If you have your Bible, I would like to invite you to return to the book of Romans with me and turn this time to Romans chapter 14. We're going to consider together a passage of scripture that I believe will summarize our lesson together, our study, as well as give us a way forward from here as we progress through June and through the remainder of our year together as a church. So I'd like to share with you from Romans chapter 14, beginning in verse one, Paul says this. He says, accept the one whose faith is weak without quarreling over disputable matters. One person's faith allows them to eat anything, but another whose faith is weak eats only vegetables. The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. Who are you to judge someone else's servant to their own master? Servants stand or fall, and they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand. One person considers one day more sacred than another. Another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God. And whoever abstains does so to the Lord and give thanks to God. For none of us lives for ourselves alone, and none of us dies for ourselves alone. If we live, we live for the Lord. And if we die, we die for the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. And for this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. You then why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat them with contempt? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat. It is written as surely as I live, says the Lord, every knee will bow before me. Every tongue will acknowledge God. So then each of us will give an account of ourselves to God. If you go back to verse one, he says, accept the one whose faith is weak without quarreling over disputable matters. Some of your translations might use the word opinions. Some of your translations might speak to quarreling. That is, do not judge, but accept one another over disputable matters or over quarreling opinions. Did you know that there are things within the church that are classified or called by Paul as disputable matters? Did you know there are things in the life of a Christian and in the life of the Bible that are differing opinions? He calls them here in verse one disputable matters. And if I were to give you a working definition for what Paul is referencing, I would define a disputable matter as something that is non essential within the christian life, a particular issue or a particular thing that would be nonessential within the christian life. Now, to be certain, there are many things that are essential, and there are many things that are absolutely certain from scripture. Particularly among the essential things are the teachings and the understanding in scripture of salvation. The means of salvation through faith in Jesus Christ is absolutely clear and absolutely ironclad in scripture and is non negotiable. The authority and inerrancy of scripture that we place our faith in for all practice and all our beliefs is non negotiable. There are many essentials that are absolutely clear in scripture, but there are some things that we encounter in our lives as believers that Paul calls disputable matters. He gives two examples of disputable matters here in Romans chapter 14. The first one involves food and drink, and the second one involves days or holy days or particular days for worship. What's important about the two examples of disputable matters that Paul gives is that they are non consequential when it comes to salvation. Are they important? In some ways they impact the way in which we live, but they are not essential for one's faith and for one's salvation. Consider these two disputable matters that Paul lists here. The first one begins in verse two, and it revolves around food and beverage. He says one person's faith allows them to eat anything, but another's, whose faith is weak eats only vegetables. Now we understand that what's taking place here is that there are many Jews who have become Christians, and now that they are living in light of their faith in Jesus Christ, they have been given an incredible freedom in terms of what they eat and what they drink. There is no longer this Old Testament legal precedence that would hang over or be part of their daily life for consideration. But there are some Christians who are following Jesus even though they have been given great freedom in Christ, that are continuing to adhere to Old Testament laws that govern food and beverage. This is the disputable matter that has come up within the church. The believers are discussing among themselves. Can we eat this meat? Can we drink this drink? Or can we have meat in a certain way? And Paul calls it a disputable matter. The second issue he brings up is about certain days. He talks about this beginning in verse five. He says one person considers one day more sacred than another, and another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. Again, what's happening in the life of the church is that you have Jews who have come to faith in Jesus Christ, and many of them are continuing to observe what would have been sacred or holy days according to the customs and the Old Testament laws. Many of the new Christians continue to follow the rituals of a jewish faith or an Old Testament faith, even though they have come to salvation through faith in Jesus Christ. Some consider certain days more sacred or more holy than others. And others consider every day an equal opportunity to worship and gather in the glory of God. Paul calls this a disputable matter. What's important to recognize here in this discussion in chapter 14 is that he is talking about believers. He is talking about those who have made a profession of faith and come to salvation through Christ Jesus. And they are wrestling with how to live out a godly life. And they're wrestling with some very real issues, such as food and certain days of the week. Now, for you and I today, some 2000 years later, we may not be wrestling with food and beverage and certain days, but did you know we still have our own disputable matters? Can I give you some examples? These would be things that are nonessential, they are non salvific, but they are certainly discussed as opinions among ourselves. Let me just give you some current disputable matters. One might be the view or opinion of the end of times. If we were to do a survey around the room of how many opinions there are about the end of times, there would be a plethora of disputable matters among us. When I was applying for seminary several years ago, I needed multiple pastoral references. And one pastor who was very close to me at the time, refused to give me a reference to a particular seminary because they taught a different view about the end of times. It's a disputable matter. Another disputable matter that the church has wrestled with is worship styles. Some say we must absolutely use the hymns for their foundation and their tradition. Others say we need to move forward and make it more approachable. It's a disputable matter. Some say there's only one translation of the Bible that we should be using. It's a disputable matter how we educate our children. A disputable matter. They're nonessential, but nonetheless they impact how we live out our christian life. And there are varying opinions, all rooted within scripture, as we are all seeking to glorify and honor God in the way in which we live. And I contend for you that the view of women in ministry is among disputable matters. But I want you to notice what Paul does in this passage of scripture. Paul certainly has an opinion on what they eat and on what days they worship. And in some ways you can gain his viewpoint or his opinion from this passage. Just look back at verse two. Paul says, one person's faith allows them to eat anything, but another, whose faith is weak only eats vegetables. Now, we know from Paul's teaching in other places of scripture that he talks about all food being permissible for the life of a believer, that they can eat all things. And so we certainly know Paul's viewpoint on this matter and certainly his position in which he is discussing. But Paul's focus in Romans chapter 14 is not to clarify the matters of food and days, but rather Paul has an entirely different focus. And it really should jump out at us. It should leap off of the pages of chapter 14, because as I read chapter 14, I am asking the question, why does Paul not tell us that the strong way is the right way? Why does Paul not correct the shallow faith of the weak ones? Why does Paul not prove them wrong? Everything in me in this conversation wants to stand up and educate those weak in their faith and say, don't you understand the freedom that Christ has bought you? But Paul does not do that. But what does Paul say? Verse one, he says, accept those whose faith is weak. Verse three, he says, the one who eats anything must not treat them with content. The one who does not. And then in verse four, he says, who are you to judge someone else's servant? Paul doesn't address the issue of the disputable matter at all. In fact, what Paul is calling us to do is to stop disputing, stop quarreling, let God be the judge. And instead of disputing, accept one another as brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus. Now, there are many things that scripture has been very clear about, and when they're doctrinal and when they're salvific, we certainly need to be clear and communicate perfectly in accordance with scripture. But there are some things that will always be disputable. There are some things that there is a breath within for the christian life, such as Paul is describing in Romans chapter 14. His intention in this chapter is to say to us that it's not worth arguing to the point of dividing the church. His point is for us to recognize that when we find common ground through faith in Christ Jesus, there is enough in our faith in Christ that will hold us together even among our differing opinions. And so here's the question I want to propose to us as a group and as a church as we close this j term course. And the question I want to propose to you is, can you be a member of First Baptist Church of Alexandria and disagree with our position for women in ministry? Now I feel compelled to remind everyone that our position for women in ministry is a historical one. Women have been in ministry at First Baptist for many years, both in roles of deacons and leadership and even to the tune of ordaining three women in pastoral ministry as a congregation and as a church. And so the question I propose again is, can you be a member of First Baptist Church of Alexandria and disagree with our position on women and ministry? And the answer is absolutely yes. And in fact, you can be a member who thrives. You can be a member who continues to grow spiritually. You can be a member who continues to serve and connect. There will always be disputable matters among us, and our position on women in ministry is rooted within scripture. It is non salvific. It is not sinful. And so therefore, if you're an individual who maybe wrestles with or struggles with our position for women in ministry, you're welcome here. And we absolutely can continue to work together and serve together and love one another and worship together and continue to pursue the gospel together, because there will always be disputable matters. And so I want you to listen one more time to verse three, and let's hear Paul's advice. The one who accepts women in ministry must not treat the one who accepts women in ministry must not treat with contempt the one who does not. And the one who does not accept women in ministry must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. Who are you to judge someone else's servant to their own master? Servants stand or fall, and they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand. Let me pray for us. Heavenly Father, we are so grateful for your word. Your word provides all things that we need for life and for godliness. Chief of Mong, your word has provided what we need for salvation. Thank you for making it known to us the truth about Christ Jesus. Thank you, Father, for making it plain to us what is most important. And Father, as we walk through this life together as a church, I pray that you would draw us together with a unity that only is possible through your spirit. Father, we are all different. We have different experiences. We have a different level of interaction with you, a different measure of faith. But Father, what we have in common is strong enough to continue to unite us as a body of believers. And so, Father, help us in our own hearts and in our own minds. Give one another the mercy and the grace to follow what you are doing in our church and in our lives. Father, help us have minds and help us have ears that will listen to one another. Help us have hearts that will pray for one another and encourage one another and strengthen one another. Father, this world is hard enough. Let us be a church that builds one another up and strengthens one another all the more as the day is quickly approaching. Father, thank you for the mercy and grace that you show us. For without the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, not a single one of us would be able to stand. And so, Father, with great humility, we continue to boldly move forward, proclaiming the gospel, loving one another, and glorifying you. We ask all this in Christ Jesus name we pray. Amen. All right, there we go. We're done. Mark is right here in the back, and I would welcome your questions. We'll do the best we can with our time, and I'll continue to watch our time, as I know parents of littles will have to go, but I would encourage you thoughts and questions that you have that would be edifying to the group. Yes, sir. Okay. Forgive me for using political sounding terms, but I can't think of any better ones. Sure, it's okay. I'm curious to know what verses the opposition might use to justify their position if other than what you've already mentioned in these five weeks. Yeah, great point. And I would say to you they would use the exact same verses that we have talked about over the last five weeks. Particularly, they would use the prohibition passages of scripture, meaning one Corinthians, chapter 14 and one Timothy, chapter two, and one Timothy, chapter three. So they are going to use the exact same passages of scripture. Now, what's interesting is the rules of logic, which we all know and we practice. The rules of logic dictate that there can only be one truth and that there can't be two truths. And so I repel the notion that there's more than one way to interpret a passage of scripture. There's not. There's one way. Now, I say that with incredible humility because I recognize that what we are saying as a church is that we have interpreted the passages in the way that we believe to be the truth. While they have interpreted passages the way that they believe to be the truth. Rules of logic say there can only be one. And scripture and the truth and authority of scripture dictates that there can only be one. And so, as Paul said in one Corinthians, chapter 14 that we just read a moment ago, each individual should do according to their own conscience when it comes to disputable matters. And he'll go on to say, if a person believes it's sinful to eat meat and then they eat meat, they are, in fact, sinning against God. And so for us as a church who has a position of scripture, of women in ministry, who's standing on scripture and within the authority of scripture, we continue to progress in our position. So to stay on point with your question, I would say they're going to use the exact same prohibition, they call them prohibition passages that we use to establish our position, but we are coming at them with two different interpretations. But we need to always have humility as we navigate that conversation, because a lack of humility will be the biggest thing to get us in trouble. I think that's in the Bible somewhere. Pride cometh before the fall. Yeah. Thank you. Other questions? Yes, sir. Well, in one Timothy 212. Yes, sir. Paul says, I do not permit. Is there any traction to be gained in the interpretation from our point of view that says, well, he doesn't say Jesus said this. He says, I don't permit it. In this particular case, he did not follow up with what I would advise him to follow up, given my views. Is I not the Lord? Where he does that in other passages, but here he just says, not me. Yeah, no, I understand that conversation very well. And I shared a little bit of an illustration one of the weeks, and it might have been on one Timothy, chapter two. And I shared a very personal story about a moment that I had with God, where I said, Paul, why did you have to say that? Or why did you have to say it that way? And in the spirit of God, he quickly reminded me that all scripture is God breathed. And Jesus taught us in the sermon on the mount that not a single letter, not a single iota of the law would disperse from the. So I think it's important for us to zoom out from Paul a little bit and say, this is God's word and God's authority. And so I think that's a safer way for us to be consistent through the passage. If we focus too much on the individual, I think we get into a slippery slope on expanding that further out. So I tend to want to approach it from, this is God's word. What does it mean and how do we apply it to the life of the church? So I completely resonate with the sentiment. Absolutely, Mark. I'll let you judge who was first, maybe who's closer and on the way. Mark, Paul says we're not to be a stumbling block to our brothers and sisters. Okay, so if I eat meat and they don't eat meat and I'm with them, then when I'm with them, I probably shouldn't eat meat. The same time. He says, let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. Am I being hypocritical if I don't eat meat? Great question. So I would argue that one Corinthians 14, which is a prohibition passage that we've talked about, really helps us in this regard, because what Paul is addressing in one Corinthians 14 is in fact saying that there is a circumstance by which we should not have a woman in ministry. Right. And so he's actually saying that if it becomes to use the phrase here in 14 becoming a stumbling block, then it would be, in fact inappropriate, just as it would be inappropriate for me. I think I also use this illustration. If I, as the senior pastor, were a cause of division within the church, I would remove myself because it's not worth me being divisive within the life of the church. There's not a point by which I could biblically justify being a point of division. So for our context at First Baptist Church of Alexandria, because of our historical, but also our biblical analysis, it is perfectly acceptable in our context for women to be in ministry. But in another context, it might not be. We had the privilege of meeting with the International Mission Board vice president this last week, and he met with luncheon with our ECC. And one of the things that he said to us that was just incredibly encouraging was women are far more effective in muslim countries. It takes women to reach muslim women. It's perfectly acceptable for a woman in that context because I am completely ineffective at reaching muslim women for Jesus Christ. So I think that we truly have to walk a very careful line out of respect for our brothers and sisters with full confidence of what the Lord is asking us to do in our life. Lottie Moon wrestled with this historically. She would remark in her journals, what am I supposed to do? Just ignore the men? Nobody's preaching to them. Am I supposed to not preach when they walk in the room? Well, of course not. Right? And so I do think that this is a fine line that we do have to walk out of respect for our brothers and sisters. To use another personal example, one of the things that's very personal to me is I've chosen to abstain from all alcohol now, scripture doesn't dictate that I do that. You can just keep reading in chapter 14 if you want, down in verse 2021. But for some of my brothers and sisters, Christ, it's a stumbling block, either because of past or an addiction. And so for me to be an effective minister in their life, I just don't need it in my life. And so I do think there are times where we have to personally sacrifice in order to be effective ministers and effective evangelists in reaching for the gospel. So I do think that that's a very valid matter for us to wrestle with. And one Corinthians 14, I think, is making that point, which is a very strong point for us to consider. Yeah, hi. Yes, ma'am. Thank you so much. What is your feeling on all of this is happening within unity in the church and that it's demonic or satanic. It's causing division. So what does the outside world see? Yeah. So why are we fighting within with minute for me is where I work. Do I order a pizza with pepperoni on it? Because I work with three Muslims, but they really don't care. And we ask, and it's just being hospitable, especially as southern Baptist as our heritage. So what is your feeling on this so far? As it is, it's causing divisiveness within our church, which is not to be. Yeah, I agree. The tragic thing is that the church has never had greater opportunity and the church has never had greater availability for the world. Evangelization, I mean, quite frankly, we are in an unprecedented time in church history of being able to reach the nations with the gospel. And so I don't think it's coincidence that the enemy has felt threatened. And if he can't win by pressing outward, he will begin to win by coming up from within. We're going to, in fact, see this Sunday morning at Nehemiah, chapter five. Nehemiah has endured persecution in chapter four from the outside. Well, what happens next? Well, now persecution begins to come from the inside. I won't launch into Sunday's sermon, but I think you're very right. There's persecution from out and persecution from within, and it's very unfortunate. It certainly hurts our testimony and certainly takes our eye off of what we've been commissioned to do as a church. I love your example about ordering pepperoni pizza. At my oldest daughter's last birthday, we ran into the same encounter where we ran out of cheese pizza with multiple muslim families at the birthday party. But it turned into an incredible opportunity to talk about Jesus and to talk about what we believe and what they believe. And what I have discovered is that in that conversation with that dad and his children, when there was only pepperoni left, we ended up having a very deep mutual respect for one another because we hold our faith so close to us. And so I think there's great opportunity, again, even in some of these things, for us to testify to Jesus and what Jesus has done. What did you say to him? I told him that my family, that we were christian and that we followed Christ and that we didn't have the same dietary laws, but we certainly respect his. And we ordered another pizza. We ordered a cheese pizza. And then I had the opportunity to say, tell me about your faith, and then let me tell you about mine. And so I was able to share the gospel with that dad. Great opportunity. Yeah. Yes, sir. So, with the SBC, if they pass this amendment, or whatever you call it. Yes, sir. What happens next? What happens to the churches that have women in ministry? Yeah, great question. So if the amendment is ratified in June, because it's a constitutional amendment, it will demand, for lack of a better phrase, churches who have women in ministry to make a change. Churches will have two years to get in line with the new constitutional amendment. And if they fail to get in line by changing their staff and changing the titles of their staff, then they will then go through the disfellowshipping process. So, for First Baptist Church of Alexandria, what we have done this year is that our executive church council has already started reviewing our four church partnerships, which are the Southern Baptist Convention, the Baptist Journal association of Virginia, the Baptist World alliance, and North Star Church Network. Those are our four constitutional partners. Starting as of last Sunday, our executive church council is meeting with each of those partners in order to review, reeducate, and also prayerfully discern if these are the partners that will help us for the next ten years. So what will happen is our executive church council will make a recommendation to the church based on their evaluation of our four constitutional partners. And should they choose to change those partnerships, it will call for a church vote to amend our constitution to drop one of those partners. So that is the glide path that we are on. So our executive church council will complete their work before June, and then we will send a full slate of messengers in June to the convention to represent our church. And then we will have our quarterly business meeting in July, where we'll report on the convention at that time. If the executive church council is prepared, they could potentially make a recommendation to amend our constitution, and we will then be in a place to call for a church vote, but it will be a matter of a congregational vote because it's an amendment to our constitution. So that's the glide path we're on. Mr. Robert, I don't know where we are. Right here. Thank you. Hi. Thank you for taking questions. The scripture that you just shared with all of us, Romans 14. Yes, ma'am. Is one about not judging one another and being united as a body. Maybe you could fix my question for me. So let me just ask, why can't the Southern Baptist convention hear the scripture that you just read and decide that this might be a disputable matter and that this shouldn't be something that creates disunity amongst the churches around the nation and that we could continue to participate with each other in the way that the Southern Baptist convention members have traditionally participated with one another? Yeah. And I would say for 23 years they did just that when they edited the baptist faith and message in the year 2000, they really made their position very clear on women in pastoral ministry. Many churches, first baptist being among them, did not ascribe to the 2000 baptist faith and message. They maintained the 1963 version. So for 23 years, we have not necessarily been in alignment with their position. And I would say that the Southern Baptists have followed Romans chapter 14 for 23 years. But we've come to a place where the messengers have put forth an amendment and the way in which baptist polity works. They have the opportunity, through a majority rule to do so, to even amend an amendment on the floor, which is certainly the case here. It is sad. It is part of the reason that it breaks all of our hearts. It's part of the reason that we're not raising our fists as we exit or leave, because we are trying to not only have humility, but maintain as much as unity possible for the sake of the gospel. So we can only do our part as a church, as we stand before God, but we certainly need to be praying, so. Absolutely. Beth? Yes, ma'am. I'll watch our time here. Yes. I'm sorry. If they pass this amendment or whatever, this vote and says that because we have a lady pastor, that we can't be a part of the SBC, you said something about we would then vote as a church on whether to leave the SBC or not. Is that correct? Yes, you're correct. So the difference in what's happening is that they're amending their constitution. The SBC is not the baptist faith and message. And so in order to be a member of the Southern Baptist Convention, you have to be in a constitutional alignment, and this matter would put us out of constitutional alignment. Since the SBC is in our constitution, First Baptist's constitution, it requires a church vote to amend the constitution, but the executive church council will make that recommendation, and then the church will have the opportunity to vote on it. So we're talking about two different constitutions, I recognize, which can get a little confusing. But what has brought all of this to head is that we would no longer be considered a church in good standing with the Southern Baptist Convention, and they would put us under review for disfellowship. We have already been under review for disfellowship in the year 2022. We came through that review when I was called as the senior pastor. They said, they're fine, but the new amendment that was proposed in June of 2023 actually says we would not be in alignment. If that amendment is ratified, it takes two years to ratify it, and so this would be the second vote on that amendment. All right, let me do one more if we can, and then I'll be available for additional questions here. But I do want to respect our time as well. Yes, ma'am. What is the difference between letting a woman be a pastor and letting a woman be a senior pastor? Is that biblical or historical tradition? I would say tradition and not biblical. Right. I would say that that's a traditional view and a cultural view. That's a way a lot of people have wrestled with it. You'll see a lot of churches, that what they do is they say they have one pastor, and then everybody else will be called ministers. They'll have a children's minister and a student minister, an adult minister. But truthfully, those ministers are fulfilling all the qualifications of first Timothy, chapter three, they're doing or two and three, they're doing all of the functions of a pastor. They have a different title. So I would contend that most baptist churches have female ministers that are functioning in a pastoral capacity according to scriptural teaching. And we're just parsing words at this point. And so it's more of a traditional as opposed to a biblical difference. Yes. All right. Thank you so much for spending this five weeks together. All of these five sessions that we have done have been recorded and will be made available in the coming weeks. So if you missed a week and want to go back and fill in or maybe you want to review it, we're going to be making that available to the church at large. But I am so thankful and so grateful for the ability to have this conversation together and to study these passages of scripture together. I know that I have been strengthened through this last five weeks, and I have grown. And I hope that that has also been your situation as well. All right. God bless. Have a good night. Thank you.